Aam's Comp

Huyio · Post by **Huyio** » Wed 01 Mar, 2006 10:53 am

It is quite possible, it could be heat throttling from the cpu. Like i suggested take off the side case direct a fan straight at the motherboard and play eq... and if it stop doing what its doing then you have a heat issue.

H

Mazia · Post by **Mazia** » Wed 01 Mar, 2006 11:06 am

Hrrrm alright - reading the board was released in 2004 late so into next things that could be the problem.

1. What Bios does the otherboard have on it?
(Either have a look when the machine is first booting or possibly
start> all programs> accessories> system tools> System information. Look for the "BIOS Version / Date" entry and post it here for me)

Reason I ask is the original manual doesnt have any information in it about 6XX models which means it will need a bios update generally so it knows what to do with all the new processor crap. Once again possibly a non issue. My last board couldnt read my brand new hard drive properly because of a "needs a bios update" type issue. It worked ok just had problems.

2. Much to my horror also the motherboard has whats called a "dynamic overclocking" option in the bios. Needless to say that scares me a little. Mind you I would think Bios editing will scare Aamasie also but anyways I want that turned off for all intensive purposes.

In the Bios---
It is the second option on the "Cell Menu" in the bios. Called "Dynamic Overclock" make that Disabled In fact the first option in the same menue "High Performance Mode" should also be Manual

3. If you have the "MSI Core Center" installed uninstall it. Wouldnt hurt for us to make sure all the fans are running in the machine tho - especially the CPU one - I assume they are

4. If you have "MSI GoodMem" installed uninstall it.

Anyways continuing to read through stuff.

I do think try disableing sound in EQ all together tho

5. run EQ and click Options button instead of logging in. Go through the EQ configurator and untick sound when you find it. Continue through config till its finish. Rerun the patcher and try everquest without sound - see if it makes a difference.

6. Getting back to the hard drive issue. At some point hard drives passed an addressing size and an updated method of addressing hard drive addresses was needed. Often this was patched with a Bios fix. I had to do it with my motherboard at home. Basically Large Block Addressing had to be increased so that it is able to access all areas of a hard drive. Some other strange things can occur. Not saying thats what it is but I suppose it could have some bearing on it. Once again whats the Bios version at the moment and we could look at updateing it.

Aamasie · Post by **Aamasie** » Wed 01 Mar, 2006 12:22 pm

Bios version/date entry is: Phoenix Technologies, LTD 600PG 8/22/05

Edit: Found the bios,

and Dynamic Overclock is <disabled> and high performance mode is <manual>.

Turned off sound, signed on EQ, it froze.

I don't see any sign of MSI Goodmem or MSI Core center.

Mazia · Post by **Mazia** » Wed 01 Mar, 2006 1:13 pm

OK that bios date is arround the right date for the latest version on their site (site says 8/23/2005 but I think its the same one) so that cancels the thoughts on it being bios VERSION oriented. Also tells me that its not some bios level overclocking stuff is funking things up....

Next thing to do. Back into "system information" click on the Hardware Resources section to expand it then click on Conflicts/Sharing. List all of the IRQ entries in a post here.

I have a vague thought that perhaps the network card and the video card are shareing the same IRQ - checking that

Aamasie · Post by **Aamasie** » Wed 01 Mar, 2006 1:57 pm

Since it won't let me cut and paste /grumble, here's my typewritten version:

I/O Port 0x00000000-0x00000CF7 PCI Bus
I/O Port 0x00000000-0x00000CF7 Direct memory access controller

IRQ 20 Standard Dual Channel PCI IDE Controller
IRQ 20 Intel (R)PRO/100 VE Network connection

I/O Port 0x000003C0-0x000003DF Intel (R) 925X/XE PCI Express Root Port - 2658
I/O Port 0x000003Co-0x000003DF Nividia GeForce 78000 GT

IRQ 23 Intel (R) 82801FB/FBM USB Universal Host Controller - 2658
IRQ 23 Intel (R) 82801FB/FBM USB2 Enhanced Host Controller = 265C

IRQ 16 Intel (R) 925X/XE PCI Express Root Port - 2585
IRQ 16 NVIDIA GeForce 7800 GT
IRQ 16 Microsoft UAA Bus Driver for HIgh Definition Audio
IRQ 16 Intel(R) 82801FB/FBM PCI Express Root Port - 2660
IRQ 16 Broadcom NexXtreme Gigabit Ethernet
IRQ 16 Intel (R) 82801FB/FBM USB Universal HOst Controller - 265B

Memory Address 0x0000000-0xD00FFFFF Intel (R) 82801FB/FBM PCI Express Root Port - 2660
Memory Address 0x0000000-0xD00FFFFF Broadcom NetXtreme Gigabit Ethernet

IRQ 19 Intel (R) 82801FB/FBM USB Universal Host Controller - 2659
IRQ 19 VIA OHCI Compliant IEEE 1394 Host Controller
IRQ 19 Intel (R) 82801FB Ultra ATA Storage Controllers - 2652

Memory Address 0xA0000-0xBFFFF PCI bus
Memory Address 0xA0000-0xBFFFF Intel (R) 925X/XE PCI Express Root Port - 2585
Memory Address 0xA0000-0xBFFFF NVIDIA GeForce 7800GT

I/O Port 0x000003B0-0x000003BB Intel (R) 925X/XE PCI Express Root Port - 2585
I/O Port 0x000003B0-0x000003BB NVIDIA GeForce 7800GT

I/0 Port 0x0000C000-0x0000CFFF Intel (R) 925X/XE PCI Express Root Port - 2585
I/O Port 0x0000C000-0x0000CFFF NVIDIA GeForce 7800 GT

Memory Address 0xB0000000-0xCFFFFFFF Intel (R) 925X/XE PCI Express Root Port - 2585
Memory Address 0xB0000000-0xCFFFFFFF NVIDIA GeForce 7800 GT

I hope that's right, not responsible for zero's.

Noggle · Post by **Noggle** » Wed 01 Mar, 2006 2:02 pm

Have you checked to make sure your power supply is strong enough?

Noggle · Post by **Noggle** » Wed 01 Mar, 2006 2:13 pm

Just re-read the whole post. Turns out you did check the power supply. The one thing that does not seem to have been checked is the thing everyone keeps tossing off as "couldn't be it". The HD. Is the seagate partitioned? If not, give that a shot and throw EQ on the smaller partition. If it is, try moving the EQ dir to a smaller drive (or a different drive of equivalent size). I know it doesn't seem like that should be a problem, but computers are weird .. my fiances comp used to lock up left and right, we spent $450 before we found the problem ... it needed a new case.

Mazia · Post by **Mazia** » Wed 01 Mar, 2006 3:07 pm

IRQ 16 Intel (R) 925X/XE PCI Express Root Port - 2585
IRQ 16 NVIDIA GeForce 7800 GT
IRQ 16 Microsoft UAA Bus Driver for HIgh Definition Audio
IRQ 16 Intel(R) 82801FB/FBM PCI Express Root Port - 2660
IRQ 16 Broadcom NexXtreme Gigabit Ethernet
IRQ 16 Intel (R) 82801FB/FBM USB Universal HOst Controller - 265B

looking at this I am thinking the gigabit ethernet might be part of the problem still a guess but lets try using the other connector on the motherboard not the one that your using atm and lets get that one disabled

First up connect the network cable to the network jack in the back of your computer thats closest to the Parallel port (Thats the big purple one.)

I am hopeing that the modem you use for broadband is giving out IP addresses for your network. Dont stress if you dont know what that means we can try and work that out later. If worst comes to worse reboot your computer at this stage and then try to hook into everquest and see if the problem is gone / better.

If you cannot get connection to EQ at all we might have to look at some settings for your network. But anyways try that to start let me know the results.

There is no problem in using the other network port as the internet is never going to run at gigabit speeds anyways

Next steps after this is to try disableing the entry for the "gigabit" internet.
Also at the same time can we go to another section in "System Information" called IRQ and copy all the stuff in there into here also.

Sorry for all the typing - it does help to work out what the computer is doing.

curtis · Post by **curtis** » Wed 01 Mar, 2006 4:21 pm

Aam, in the file menu of the system information tool is a command Export...

You can use this to export the data to a text file, then copy and paste from the text file

Naervhun · Post by **Naervhun** » Wed 01 Mar, 2006 4:34 pm

Have you checked to see if the bio's to see that the onboard vidoe is disabled? Agree with Noggle possable Hard drive issuse might try the partitioning to see if that may help. and or see if the HD can me manufacture returned for another might be the problem.

Mazia · Post by **Mazia** » Wed 01 Mar, 2006 5:38 pm

There is no onboard video on that make of motherboard. Sorry not thinking outside the box on the export information pointer of Curts - thanks for that.

Aamasie · Post by **Aamasie** » Thu 02 Mar, 2006 12:26 pm

Will add to this as I try things.

The network cable was already in the port nearest to the purple cable, so I moved it to the higher port, restarted the computer, tested on EQ and it froze within a minute of signing on.

How does one disable the gigabit internet?

System Information, IRQ is:

System Information report written at: 03/01/06 20:30:13
System Name: DEBBIE-7517DFD9
[IRQs]

Resource Device Status
IRQ 9 Microsoft ACPI-Compliant System OK
IRQ 16 Intel(R) 925X/XE PCI Express Root Port - 2585 OK
IRQ 16 NVIDIA GeForce 7800 GT OK
IRQ 16 Microsoft UAA Bus Driver for High Definition Audio OK
IRQ 16 Intel(R) 82801FB/FBM PCI Express Root Port - 2660 OK
IRQ 16 Broadcom NetXtreme Gigabit Ethernet OK
IRQ 16 Intel(R) 82801FB/FBM USB Universal Host Controller - 265B OK
IRQ 23 Intel(R) 82801FB/FBM USB Universal Host Controller - 2658 OK
IRQ 23 Intel(R) 82801FB/FBM USB2 Enhanced Host Controller - 265C OK
IRQ 19 Intel(R) 82801FB/FBM USB Universal Host Controller - 2659 OK
IRQ 19 VIA OHCI Compliant IEEE 1394 Host Controller OK
IRQ 19 Intel(R) 82801FB Ultra ATA Storage Controllers - 2652 OK
IRQ 18 Intel(R) 82801FB/FBM USB Universal Host Controller - 265A OK
IRQ 5 Network Controller OK
IRQ 20 Standard Dual Channel PCI IDE Controller OK
IRQ 20 Intel(R) PRO/100 VE Network Connection OK
IRQ 0 System timer OK
IRQ 8 System CMOS/real time clock OK
IRQ 13 Numeric data processor OK
IRQ 6 Standard floppy disk controller OK
IRQ 4 Communications Port (COM1) OK
IRQ 14 Primary IDE Channel OK
IRQ 15 Secondary IDE Channel OK
IRQ 10 Intel(R) 82801FB/FBM SMBus Controller - 266A OK

Noggle · Post by **Noggle** » Thu 02 Mar, 2006 1:13 pm

From my own comp experience, this is my observations:

RAM Problem: You'll get glitchy or no video. Your comp will reboot itself. Your comp will lock on you. You'll blue screen alot.

Processor Problem: Computer won't start.

Processor Problem (Heat): Computer will restart itself or shut dwn completely (in recent models, usually after a few minutes of a really annoying alarm sound)

Video Card Problem: You'll have flickering. Game will lock (at the same time, freezing your comp entirely). EQ simply will not run. Transparents show up black. Incorrect color placement (such as stark white "armor"). Serious video lag issues (like 2 frames per second if that).

Network Problem: EQ Will not connect at all. EQ will LD repeatedly. EQ will stay active, but lag spikes can last up to 15 minutes. Packet loss.

Sound Problem: EQ will crash, and follow closely with a blue screen. Sound will glitch out and repeat the same annoying buzzing sound until the comp is rebooted or speakers are manually shut down.

Power Supply Problem: Comp will reboot itself when running heavy processing.

Aam's problem does not lie in -any- of these fields. Her game locks, but she can alt+tab out and do other stuff. What this says to me, is that the computer is having trouble reading that particular program. I am assuming she is fine on RAM, and she obviously has enough space for virtual memory. This leaves one possibility ... the Hard Drive. I could be wrong, but for some reason I doubt it in this instance. The ability to tab out and continue other work when the game is locked is too weird. A card failure would cause a full lockup. An IRQ conflict (which I have not seen in 5 years) would cause blue screens, or, again, a full lockup. Give the HD a shot. I'm assuming by the fact that you have upgraded so much that it is likely you have another HD. It's possible this problem could be solved very easily. If I am wrong, I will buy everybody pizza ... someday.

Mazia · Post by **Mazia** » Thu 02 Mar, 2006 1:44 pm

Disableing the Gigabit ethernet port (make sure you move the cable back to the other port close to the purple)

right click on my computer
select manage from the menue
click on device manager
expand the section called Network adapters
right click on Broadcom NetXtreme Gigabit Ethernet
select Properties
in the window that pops up down the bottom is Device Usage
Change that to Do not use this device (disabled)

That will disable it. However I am unsure thats guna do much for us at this point.

Next thingy to try
OK next dum thoughts start EQ and disable everything turn on old world modles for everything turn off horse and elementals etc etc etc

Change screen resolution to 800x600 and keep sound off

Start up EQ and see if it still locks up after a few minutes - report results here.

Do you have ANY virus software installed at all? If yes Disable and try again.

Are you using the Default UI?

Likely a silly question but does anyone know what happens if a PCIExpress video card doesnt have the special extra power connector connected to it - will it run at all?

What was the name of the latest video card drivers that you installed - version number etc?

Aamasie · Post by **Aamasie** » Thu 02 Mar, 2006 1:57 pm

Noggle,

Maybe I didn't express this clearly, when EQ freezes, everything freezes, mouse included, and I can't do anything.

The freezing lasts about 15 or 20 seconds, than I can alt tab out, do other stuff, etc. etc.

With all this tweaking, the timeframe between freezes does seem to be lengthening (optimistic I am, but it really does seem to be true).

varutia · Post by **varutia** » Thu 02 Mar, 2006 3:25 pm

After reviewing the whole thing again, I say it is processor problem and heat related at that. Find a first person shot them up game and play to see if you get the same issue, I bet you would as well.

See if you can get other processor that is compatitable with your motherboard and stick them in to test this thoery. If problem solved, most likly issue is heatsink not glued properly to the CPU, in that case it is a easy fix.

Vexo · Post by **Vexo** » Thu 02 Mar, 2006 3:57 pm

Heating issues just usually crash the entire thing, in my experience anywayz. And if she survives the freeze, it'd indicate something less trivial at work. /shrugs

varutia · Post by **varutia** » Thu 02 Mar, 2006 4:26 pm

With older CPUs when overheating, system reset is the most likly result provide the CPU did not burn out. The newer CPU got inbuild protection that would just slow the CPU right up to prevent it being burned out.

A long time ago I use to use AMD CPU and it burns around 50 normally and 70+ when I play games in a cool room. So I played around with an application that suppose to slow your CPU when you not using it normally to save power and generate less heat. Unfortunately it creates the freezing issue, like freeze for 2 seconds every 10 second or so, I uninstalled it straight way. In the end the CPU did not burn out, but the extreme temperature took out my motherboard out instead

This reminds in some bios they have a temperature setting so CPU can tune themself down when it goes over that setting for it's own protection. I really need study more about this thing and actually read the manual for Aam's motherboard.

Temvardar · Post by **Temvardar** » Thu 02 Mar, 2006 4:47 pm

Intel, there's ya problem right there AMD all the way!

Seriously thow it sounds like your PC may be having video issues, does the PC exihibit these problems with other 3d applications? Have you tried running EQ in windowed mode only? Have you run Dxdiag and installed the latest DX runtime drivers?

If it was a problem with the CPU overheating then your whole system would become unstable after EQ freezes, the fact that you get control back after a pause points away from CPU overheating (besides most MB's have crappy thermal sensors that will make the bios beep and shut down if the CPU runs to hot).

Best thing to do Aam would be to steal a vid card from one of your other PC's and install it into your new PC and see if it still freezes in EQ. If it doesn't then there is obviously issues with the 7800GT, install the GT into another PC (if at all possible) and try to run EQ.

Alternatively if you can disable all graphical features in EQ (especially particles), remember others (like roo) have had crashing problems due to particles (like when it rained in EQ). If EQ then runs stable try turning on each option one at a time to narow it down.

If all this fails then kick the PC, swear at it and generally abuse it, this can suprisingly work for unknown reasons but is a well known fix for all dodgy hardware on this planet

Sonna · Post by **Sonna** » Thu 02 Mar, 2006 5:55 pm

umm i wish i had somethign helpful to add to this but umm i dont

nfi about computers

hope it all works out Aama

/comfort

Aamasie · Post by **Aamasie** » Fri 03 Mar, 2006 12:20 pm

Going to disable one of the ports, however, do you want the cable in the closest to the purple plug (where it is now) or further away, which is where it was before.

It was originally plugged in the port furthest away from the purple plug, when you had me switch it, it moved closest to the purple plug.

Mazia · Post by **Mazia** » Fri 03 Mar, 2006 12:42 pm

Put it in the one thats closest to the printer port / large plug / purpleplug

That plug is the non broadcom gigabit one. (actually an Intel VE 10/100 plug)

Once thats done disable the Broadcom Gigabit port in the device manager.

Its still not makeing heaps of sence to me in my head whats going on. It screams video conflict / issue or CPU throttling I am just at a loss as to why its doing it.

Anyways start by disabling the thing above then we can try other things.

Another question - do you have any USB devises plugged into the machine, Printers, Mouse, Modem, keyboard or other?

Aamasie · Post by **Aamasie** » Fri 03 Mar, 2006 1:28 pm

Gigabit ethernet port disabled.

Removed the side of the case, and put a fan on it.

No virus anything installed in the computer.

EQ default UI is being used.

How can you check to see what the date on the latest drivers install?

I don't have enough time to turn off models and test EQ, will do that tomorrow.

No printer has been connected to the computer, just the mouse/keyboard and cable modem. No speakers.

Did I miss any important questions?

Thanks for all the help and suggestions guys. I really appreciate it.

Mazia · Post by **Mazia** » Fri 03 Mar, 2006 2:59 pm

I assume with all of the above done same problem.

You can check in start> control panel> add remove programs and look for the nvidia entry - will usually be called a number (no idea what they are up to)

Failing that you CAN check it in device manager, find the display adapters entry in that and properties on one of the entries, and then click the driver tab. Will be listed there - date AND driver version

OK next we download the latest Nvidea reference drivers and reinstall them I would think

www.nvidia.com

Download the latest driver pack - site isnt working for me at the moment. We will install that next might as well do that before nerfing the graphics in EQ

Turook · Post by **Turook** » Sat 04 Mar, 2006 11:46 pm

Ok I havn't butted back in again, cos the boys have basically been telling you what I would tell you.
At this point however, I have exhuasted all possible theories and it comes to this.

The video and the Ethernet being on the samn IRQ is a possible problem.
I Would be looking at forcing the network to another IRQ. I still find it hilarious that the moment I stopped using the onboard marvell network and swapped to a Asus wireless card my own EQ crashing problems stopped. Once again I fail to see how the network driver would cause video problems, but it is an ONLINE game, if the internet conection fails to send the data it is the same as the comp freezing and we have proven that it's not the comp freezing, it's the game freezing. So network is a huge possible.

The HDD is yet another possible. I would suggest partitioning the HDD into a 20 gig partition to put the operating system on, then another small partition to put EQ onto. Get EQ off the same partition that the OS is on.
It would be my hope that you could actually grab an old HDD and use that instead.

If it was possible for you to find an old PCI video card to try out, I would do so, but good luck at finding one, let alone one that would play EQ now.
I have the thought that it is a problem with the motherboard or videocard interpreting the drivers or maybe Direct X. I actually cured one EQ problem going backwards in video drivers.

Which is the last thing I will suggest. Wipe the computer, format and partition the hard drive the way I said (or more preferable get a small old 80 gig HDD), load XP onto it, but do not install the video drivers at all or the MB drivers. Only install the ethernet drivers. Try to force the ethernet to a different IRQ. You will still have to install directX to run EQ. last but not least, DO NOT copy any files from the old computers for EQ, do a complete fresh install.

While I feel that it's a driver??? issue. With the amount of people that have all gone Blah Blah replace 300gig Seagate drive and viloa it now works I have the feeling that replacing/fooling with HDD partitions is the best bet.

Western Australia	NSW / Victoria	Queensland	Japan	Pacific Time - EQ	US Central	US Eastern